[scribus] pdf size

[Andreas Vox]

Hi, I've several comments on this.

> From: "Wayne DePrince Jr." <waynedpj at in-giro.org>
> To: Scribus User Mailing List <scribus at lists.scribus.net>
> Subject: Re: [scribus] pdf size
> Message-ID: <1402402549.28611.74.camel at localhost.localdomain>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> On lun, 2014-05-19 at 11:20 +0100, ZASKE Martin wrote: 
> 
>> On 16.05.2014 14:10, Wayne DePrince Jr. wrote:
>>>    this thread is full of all good information as an addendum to that
>>> in the wiki.  i am having similar issues and did not think of text as
>>> being a potential cause of the large PDF size.  is there a way to avoid
>>> having Scribus outline each glyph?  does it depend on the font type?
>>> 
>>> thanks, w
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> There is a special tab in the Export-to-PDF window which is dedicated to
>> fonts. It gives all the options available. (Gregory has already
>> explained that because of license issues, some options might not be
>> available. This depends on your fonts-philosophy and/or budget.)
>> 
>> So yes, if you use a font where you have the necessary rights, you can
>> chose to leave out the font, to embed or to outline. Or even to mix the
>> options, selecting font by font.
>> 
>> We like this very much, as we are working with an "exotic" language and
>> most of our readers would not be able to show or print, unless we
>> outline. Our Unicode fonts also happen to be very large as they cater
>> for many languages, so outlining in our context even reduces file size!!
>> 
>> 
>> So from our perspective Scribus is giving great options. And it is not
>> about "avoiding" to outline or not. It is about choices.
> 
> 
>    i totally agree about the benefits of having choices.  my concern
> (and reason for avoiding font outlining) is that if a font was outlined,
> the actual "text" was no longer available in the final PDF, thus text
> searching was not possible.  most likely i am not understanding
> correctly what outlining a font actually entails.  however, in my tests
> when a font is outlined, text searching in the PDF does not work as
> expected (i.e. when the font is actually embedded).
> 

This should not be true for how Scribus outlines fonts. Scribus creates a 
Type3 PDF font with the necessary glyphs. We just need to add the correct 
Unicode mapping, so Adobe Reader can select this text.
(When I started this post I thought this already happens, but I just checked 
the code and apparently it's not)

> 
> From: Peter Nermander <peter at nermander.se>
> To: Scribus User Mailing List <scribus at lists.scribus.net>
> Subject: Re: [scribus] pdf size
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAODejyvEWdyfyzG+USunX=ggM1rTFq2A0Q8eRVps8Bt8hytxDA at mail.gmail.com>
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> 
>> This is why I never even try to "promote" our local solutions (fixes) as
>> THE solution; I just share what works for us (and sorry if I forgot to
>> mention that outlining fonts does sacrifice searchability). Seeing that
>> Scribus is used in so many different settings is why we so appreciate
>> the choices in Scribus. There is no best solution for every need.
>> 
> 
> I think the major reason that issues like this often comes up on the list
> is that a lot of people are misunderstanding what Scribus is. They think
> Scribus is "a PDF creator", while Scribus main target really is "design
> pages for print".
> 
> When printing, it does not matter whether text is text or graphics, in
> printed form they look the same.
> 
> PDFs have many uses, but Scribus is not (currently) the best tool for all
> uses of PDF.
> 
> I'd even go so far as to say:
> 
> You want to create a PDF? Don't use Scribus. First have a look at
> Libre/Open Office or any of the "PDF Printers" out there.
> 
> You want to create a printed matter? Scribus may be your tool. But
> Libre/Open Office or any of the "PDF Printers" out there may work well too.
> 

Scribus is the tool of choice if you give the PDF away to a print shop. Dunno how well LO/OO work in that context.


> From: William Adams <will.adams at frycomm.com>
> To: Scribus User Mailing List <scribus at lists.scribus.net>
> Subject: Re: [scribus] pdf size
> Message-ID: <EEC450EB-9A21-44B8-B27F-41944710A46D at frycomm.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> On Jun 11, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Peter Nermander wrote:
> 
>> When printing, it does not matter whether text is text or graphics, in
>> printed form they look the same.
> 
> That's a bit disingenuous.
> 
> When printing, there are at least two instances were text is handled differently than graphics:
> 
> - small black text is typically set to overprint, small coloured text will often be dis-allowed if it is on too many plates
> - the fill rules for text are only fill if the center of a pixel is w/in the path, while for graphics it's if any portion of the pixel falls w/in the path
> 
> William

Thanks for that insight. I think the first point isn't an issue with digital hi-res printers 
(there should be no registration errors and you can set "overprint" in Scribus manually)

The second point is the reason why outlined/subset text looks heavier in Scribus-generated PDFs. 
Since Type3 fonts consist basically of small graphics objects as glyphs, they use the fill rules for graphics, not for fonts. 

Scribus is still missing the availability to create true CFF or TrueType subset fonts; instead is uses automatically Type3 fonts when asked to subset.

And, as noted above, it currently doesn't create Unicode mapping for Type3 fonts.

/Andreas